Do you believe you should be liable for a ticket if you leave your car idling in your driveway? - Page 9
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    The Car Lounge

    View Poll Results: Do you believe you should be liable for a ticket if you leave your car idling in your driveway?

    Voters
    206. You may not vote on this poll
    • NO

      146 70.87%
    • YES

      60 29.13%
    Page 9 of 10 FirstFirst ... 5678910 LastLast
    Results 201 to 225 of 236
    1. #201
      Senior Member @McMike's Avatar
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      ^ I can't tell if you agree with him or not.

    2. #202
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      So remote start is now illegal?

    3. #203
      Member NeverEnoughCars's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by troyguitar View Post
      So remote start is now illegal?
      In certain areas it is and has been.
      people most likely voted, or more likely failed to show up to vote, on it.
      Quote Originally Posted by Turbio! View Post
      Pedantry: winning arguments through exasperation since 1651. An Old World Tradition!
      "Now i am become death the destroyer of worlds."-bhagavad gita
      “Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.” -T.S. Eliot

    4. #204
      Quote Originally Posted by troyguitar View Post
      So remote start is now illegal?
      Apparently, as the law is so vague as to be minsconstrued by local law enforcement to mean all vehicles, not ones that may be running, but are secured.
      DCIVW
      CE.

    5. #205
      Quote Originally Posted by VR6JH View Post
      I leave old WW2 land mines scattered around my yard and driveway. I mean sure, someone COULD be walking on my property and blow themselves up, but thats not my problem. They shouldn't be there anyways. Whats next? Banning landmines? DARN POLICE STATE.

      Sure, cars pollute, but they arent as bad as coal powered power plants. So we should just ignore car pollution. Just like how burglary isnt really as bad as murder, which is why we ignore burglers and only catch murders.

      Speaking of murder, ITS MY PROPERTY, I SHOULD BE ABLE TO DO WHATEVER THE HELL I WANT. So I want to leave my car idling? No problem. Stay out of my life big government.
      You're fu*king with me, Right?

      Land mines have ONE purpose in life. Hurt or kill people. If you set out land mines, you set them out with the intention of hurting or killing people. That is illegal.

      Ladders and kids are not intended to hurt or kill people. Your comparison of the two is as asinine as the idling law.

      You CAN do what ever the hell you want, as long as it doesnt impose on the rights of others and as long as it is not illegal. Murdering someone obviously imposes on their right to live and is illegal.

      Do I really have to spell this out for you?

    6. #206
      Member Carson Fiber's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by fixmy59bug View Post
      Questions for Roseville Police Chief James Berlin...

      If I leave my garage door open, someone could come by and steal my ladder. Should it now be illegal to leave my garage door open?

      If I let my kids outside to play soccer in the park, someone could come by and kidnap my kids. Should it now be illegal for them to play outside?

      It is ASININE to fine someone because an action (or inaction) on their part COULD lead to someone knowingly breaking a different law. How about increasing (or even enforcing) the penalties for the laws that are ALREADY ON THE GOD DAMN BOOKS!!!
      Not nearly as asinine as spending thousands of dollars on a car and setting it up to make it so easy for any punk to steal. And then expect me to pick up your expenses on my car insurance premium.
      4 BANGER 4 LIFE

    7. #207
      Member worth_fixing's Avatar
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      just get a block heater. It's much better for your car + environment anyway.

      Also, for those arguing that it's your property and you can do what you want : the air that enters and leaves your property doesn't belong to you, and if you're uselessly messing it up, especially for no reason, then yea ticket.

      Edit: oh wait, this is in insurance thing. well don't leave your ****e unattended. do you think thieves make a distinction between on the street and on your driveway?
      http://badges.fuelly.com/images/sig-metric/286588.png
      The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten." -Benjamin Franklin
      Kind regards,
      James

    8. #208
      Member BetterByDesign's Avatar
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      What would the ticket actually say?



      ______________________________________________

    9. #209
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      You need a depends option. I'm totally fine if you can remotely monitor kill motor and track you car.

    10. #210
      Member barry2952's Avatar
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      Mixed feelings.

      Kids steal from cars and given the opportunity have been known to steal cars. A well-known recent case is an 8 year-old that took his 4 year-old sister to the local burger place for some drive-through knoshing. I say, why give them the opportunity? I think that's the intent of the law.

      If the judge interprets the law as an anti-theft/public safety issue then a cop should be able to use some degree of common sense when the doors are locked. That's not rocket science.

    11. #211
      Member weirdajs's Avatar
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      Yes you are liable for leaving your car run while idling. When I did work for a new/used dealership I saw a local policeman trying to tell the dealership that idling their vehicles is illegal. He said he was going to ticket the dealership $125 ticket per vehicle. The GM said to the policeman we are rearranging our lot so we can plow the snow off our lot. Policeman was not having it so he started writing tickets for each vehicle.

      Then few minutes later I saw the owner literally go off on the policeman saying he pays his taxes and how can he be ticketed when he big name in this town etc.. The dealership did end up getting a couple of idling tickets for $125 per ticket because owner was going off on the policeman.

    12. #212
      Member Carson Fiber's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by weirdajs View Post
      Yes you are liable for leaving your car run while idling. When I did work for a new/used dealership I saw a local policeman trying to tell the dealership that idling their vehicles is illegal. He said he was going to ticket the dealership $125 ticket per vehicle. The GM said to the policeman we are rearranging our lot so we can plow the snow off our lot. Policeman was not having it so he started writing tickets for each vehicle.

      Then few minutes later I saw the owner literally go off on the policeman saying he pays his taxes and how can he be ticketed when he big name in this town etc.. The dealership did end up getting a couple of idling tickets for $125 per ticket because owner was going off on the policeman.
      Too bad they didn't get more. In fact this week I was unhappy with a place I took my car to for routine maintenance. When I picked up my car instead of giving me my keys they just told me to take the car. After that I found it sitting outside with the keys carelessly placed in the ignition or something I would never do!!!
      4 BANGER 4 LIFE

    13. #213
      Quote Originally Posted by Carson Fiber View Post
      Too bad they didn't get more. In fact this week I was unhappy with a place I took my car to for routine maintenance. When I picked up my car instead of giving me my keys they just told me to take the car. After that I found it sitting outside with the keys carelessly placed in the ignition or something I would never do!!!
      Every dealership does that around here. Hate it.

    14. #214
      Crazy. Is there any other law that punishes you for putting your own property at risk of being stolen? Isn't this a form of victim blaming? Maybe outlaw women from drinking alcohol on a date as they increase the risk of rape.

    15. #215
      Member barry2952's Avatar
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      Whether you think the law is valid or not, it is the law.

      This link takes you to a section on the law that explains whey unsecured cars are treated the same as an unsecured horse.

      https://books.google.com/books?id=Y-...%20law&f=false

    16. #216
      Quote Originally Posted by barry2952 View Post
      Whether you think the law is valid or not, it is the law.

      This link takes you to a section on the law that explains whey unsecured cars are treated the same as an unsecured horse.

      https://books.google.com/books?id=Y-...%20law&f=false
      Hmmm, but if I leave my car unsecured, it won't run around pooping on the sidewalk and eating my neighbors flowers.

    17. #217
      Member Carson Fiber's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Porkchopexpress View Post
      Crazy. Is there any other law that punishes you for putting your own property at risk of being stolen? Isn't this a form of victim blaming? Maybe outlaw women from drinking alcohol on a date as they increase the risk of rape.
      It's not the first time people have been punished for putting their property along with others at risk. For example building inspectors are constantly punishing people for putting their property at risk, for good reason.
      4 BANGER 4 LIFE

    18. #218
      Member barry2952's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Porkchopexpress View Post
      Hmmm, but if I leave my car unsecured, it won't run around pooping on the sidewalk and eating my neighbors flowers.
      It's OK that you don't get it.

    19. #219
      Quote Originally Posted by Carson Fiber View Post
      It's not the first time people have been punished for putting their property along with others at risk. For example building inspectors are constantly punishing people for putting their property at risk, for good reason.
      You twisted my statement.

    20. #220
      Quote Originally Posted by barry2952 View Post
      It's OK that you don't get it.
      Oh... I get it, the horse was the car the whole time! Plot twist.

    21. #221
      Member George Bluth's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Porkchopexpress View Post
      Oh... I get it, the horse was the car the whole time! Plot twist.
      Did you know that in the movie The Sixth Sense, that dead guy was Bruce Willis the whole time.

      Yeah, crazy.

    22. #222
      Namby pambys

      Just start it and go. Sure, let the idle settle, and go easy on it those first couple miles. Wear a coat and sac-up

    23. #223
      Member NeverEnoughCars's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by thetwodubheads View Post
      Namby pambys

      Just start it and go. Sure, let the idle settle, and go easy on it those first couple miles. Wear a coat and sac-up
      Or just park in your heated garage and never worry about things like this again.
      Quote Originally Posted by Turbio! View Post
      Pedantry: winning arguments through exasperation since 1651. An Old World Tradition!
      "Now i am become death the destroyer of worlds."-bhagavad gita
      “Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.” -T.S. Eliot

    24. #224
      Senior Member AZGolf's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Porkchopexpress View Post
      Hmmm, but if I leave my car unsecured, it won't run around pooping on the sidewalk and eating my neighbors flowers.
      Unsecured cars get stolen and are then used in drive-by shootings, robberies, hit & runs, and so on. That's way worse than horse droppings.

    25. #225
      It's going to come down to the jurisdiction, the specifics in the law, and the charge. So if you receive one be sure to look up if they've charged you under a law actually on the books. If they have not properly documented the infraction it will be thrown out. Make sure if the statute relies on keys in the car but yours weren't, the ticket might be invalid if it doesn't say the keys were in the car.

      These laws are not driven by horse statutes, although horse statutes might apply in the case where an unsecured car trespasses (if you will) into another property and causes damage, failure to secure. That's a liability application, a particular favorite on bar exams. This is a civil ordinance. The driver is not the beloved equus of 1900 but the Environmental Protection Agency, and to a degree the Department of Energy. They are the organizations most responsible for supporting the now widely held view that running a car is a better way to warm it up than just warming it up.

      So looking at the AZ Statute it is limited (as it should be) by time place and scope. There is a statute presumably built on public safety grounds for failing to properly secure a car by a roadway. And there is a standard AZ ordinance...

      A. By July 1, 2002, a county that contains any portion of area A as defined in section 49-451 shall adopt, implement and enforce ordinances that place limits on the maximum idling time for engines that propel heavy-duty diesel vehicles with a gross vehicle weight rating of more than fourteen thousand pounds. The ordinances shall at least include exemptions for:

      And that goes on, absolving police and fire vehicles first.

      B. A county with a population of less than one million two hundred thousand persons shall adopt, implement and enforce the ordinances required by this section only for those portions of the county that are located in area A.

      And that goes on. There are elements of the statute that exempt cases where the drivers safety might be at risk, etc. so even the statutes are open to interpretation, and that matters once you try to enforce them, as I've noted above.

      In any case the justification here is probably based on pollution statutes, since they are referring to region A and that's an air quality region. But a municipality could also enforce these on existing noise statutes, or other such grounds. Municipal Lawyers who specialize in balancing issues of property and the public good would track this better from here.

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