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    1. #76
      Quote Originally Posted by PlatinumGLS View Post
      FWIW, my cousin just turned in his Discovery lease and he couldn't wait to get rid of it. Constant issues. He loves his e-Golf replacement though.
      Well, yeah. That too. My aunt had a Range Rover for probably less than 20k miles because she couldn’t keep it out of the shop. After that she had a Q7 that was bullet proof. Now, back to Land Rover, and surprise(!) reliability issues.

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    3. #77
      Member pontiac's Avatar
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      Just had a 2019 Camry SE for a week. What a game changer TNGA is over the previous generation. Ride is great and it will actually go around a corner. The 2.5 liter and 8 speed are so much more likeable than a little turbo motor and a CVT. Shifts from the paddles were reasonably quick and smooth up and down, though obviously it's no PDK. Some hard plastics in the interior but I found it decently laid out and easy to use, lots of hard buttons for primary functions rather than having to use the screen. Seating position is good, great visibility with the low beltline.

      Overall just a really good family sedan. Still does typical Camry stuff well but significantly better to drive than any Toyota product I've ever been in.

    4. #78
      Member HorrorPunk's Avatar
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      Last year I had a work trip to Sonoma, so my company booked me an "Intermediate 2/4 Door" at SFO Hertz. I had zero desire to drive the base Mazda 3 which they had to offer, so I asked if I could upgrade to the 2018 Chrysler 300 S nearby. They said for an extra $10 a day I could do that, so the swap was made!

      I totally enjoyed my 4 days driving around the vineyards of Sonoma and taking co-workers to and from meetings.

      Pros: The V6 had plenty of power, decent gas mileage and the sound system was great (the amount of bass was fun! HaHa)! Seats were super comfy and everything was within reach and easy to use/figure out.

      Cons: The shifter for the transmission was a little "wonky." Every time I went from P-R-N-D, there was quite the delay. The car had 10K miles on it, so maybe people had been beating it hard?!

      Anyway, it was a great car, would totally rent again.


    5. #79
      Member Stevo12's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by pontiac View Post
      Just had a 2019 Camry SE for a week. What a game changer TNGA is over the previous generation. Ride is great and it will actually go around a corner. The 2.5 liter and 8 speed are so much more likeable than a little turbo motor and a CVT. Shifts from the paddles were reasonably quick and smooth up and down, though obviously it's no PDK. Some hard plastics in the interior but I found it decently laid out and easy to use, lots of hard buttons for primary functions rather than having to use the screen. Seating position is good, great visibility with the low beltline.

      Overall just a really good family sedan. Still does typical Camry stuff well but significantly better to drive than any Toyota product I've ever been in.
      Last year I had a long weekend work trip up to Montreal, drove to/from in a '19 Camry LE. Loved most everything about the car (as a daily driver and trip car) except for the occasional floatiness in the suspension. Liked it so much I ended up getting a '18 SE, actually an ex-rental car. The SE is slightly more screwed down, which fixed the floatiness problem. It will never be confused with a sports car, but the chassis is very competent in dealing with everyday stuff. It's kind of like non-sport pkg Euro car. It's still a 4-cylinder, but with 200 hp it's enough to keep it from being anemic.

      And in black, it does look the part. It hides most of the weird that goes on in the front/rear bumper treatment and complements the black/machined wheel finish. For a daily that I don't have to worry about, I'm pretty happy with it.


    6. #80
      Member pontiac's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Stevo12 View Post
      Last year I had a long weekend work trip up to Montreal, drove to/from in a '19 Camry LE. Loved most everything about the car (as a daily driver and trip car) except for the occasional floatiness in the suspension. Liked it so much I ended up getting a '18 SE, actually an ex-rental car. The SE is slightly more screwed down, which fixed the floatiness problem. It will never be confused with a sports car, but the chassis is very competent in dealing with everyday stuff. It's kind of like non-sport pkg Euro car. It's still a 4-cylinder, but with 200 hp it's enough to keep it from being anemic.

      And in black, it does look the part. It hides most of the weird that goes on in the front/rear bumper treatment and complements the black/machined wheel finish. For a daily that I don't have to worry about, I'm pretty happy with it.
      I was curious how much stiffer the SE was than the LE. I definitely wouldn't want it to be any softer even though it stayed fairly composed well beyond how 99%+ of Camry buyers will drive it. It wasn't what I'd call fun but it doesn't feel like it hates you for trying to drive it quickly like the few previous generations of Camry.

    7. #81
      Member Stevo12's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by pontiac View Post
      I was curious how much stiffer the SE was than the LE. I definitely wouldn't want it to be any softer even though it stayed fairly composed well beyond how 99%+ of Camry buyers will drive it. It wasn't what I'd call fun but it doesn't feel like it hates you for trying to drive it quickly like the few previous generations of Camry.
      It's not a huge amount. The LE left a good enough impression on me that I seriously looked into it a few months later when I decided to replace my Frontier with a family car. I know Toyota talks up the "sport-tuned suspension" (my sales guy sure did) but I do regard it as a well-tuned suspension that has a good ride/handling balance.

      Ultimately, it probably won't hold up to the best family-friendly sports cars, but then again I'm not looking for it to pull "fun car" duty - that's what my M3 is for. Plus, my son isn't old enough yet to appreciate fun drives with dad at "don't tell mom" speeds (mom isn't a fan of spirited drives either) but you're right in that it doesn't feel like it hates you for trying to put it through its paces. Another Euro car trait is that it makes the speed disappear, it just drives at 80+ down the highway with confidence. Best of all...it's an N/A Toyota with a torque-converter auto (which has pretty damn good response for an auto) which is about as simple as you can get these days - and it still pulls mid-high 30's for fuel mileage, not far off the pace set by our tin-can Mazda3 that we used to have.

    8. #82
      Member pontiac's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Stevo12 View Post
      Best of all...it's an N/A Toyota with a torque-converter auto (which has pretty damn good response for an auto) which is about as simple as you can get these days - and it still pulls mid-high 30's for fuel mileage, not far off the pace set by our tin-can Mazda3 that we used to have.
      The powertrain is the biggest reason it's on my short list to replace our Civic, even before getting one for a rental. I'm not a fan of modern CVTs and turbo engines. My mpg in the Camry was about the same as I average my Civic despite the Camry having 60 more hp and being 500+ lbs heavier.

    9. #83
      Member 2.0_Mazda's Avatar
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      Just came back from a half road trip around Alberta. I flew to Calgary, rented a car to drive to Banff, and drove back with a friend to Montreal.

      My ride to Banff: 2020 Dodge Charger GT

      I worked as a valet while in school and having parked hundreds of them, I didn't think I'd like it at all. In contrast, I loved my Charger GT. It's not a good car, nor sophisticated or efficient in any way but it's great fun. Played around with the electronic 0-100 timer and managed only 7.9 but the V6 sounded good. Comfortable, easy highway cruiser and seeing it was a rental, could beat the sh!t out of it. I really liked it and can see why some people go for the V8 or Hellcat version of these. I have a new respect for Dodge to make something stupid but fun. Too bad I only had it for a day.



    10. #84
      Member Stevo12's Avatar
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      Why does Ford Fusion fuel economy suck so much a$$?

      My latest rental was a '20 Fusion SEL, FWD with the 1.5T...like this:



      I've had a few Titanium models with AWD and the 2.0T. They got ~25 MPG on mostly highway trips. That felt low to me but I figured that was the price to pay for 2.0T power and AWD, even if comparable Audi A4's manage to eke out over 30 MPG in similar conditions.

      Then I got this FWD model down in Atlanta. I figured that with the 1.5T and FWD, that this was their fuel economy leader (with the exception of the Hybrid). I was very surprised to notice after a few days that the fuel gauge had dipped below the 3/4 mark, after only a few days of shuttling back and forth to the job site. When I returned it, I learned that it had traveled 129 miles since pick-up, and being a connected car, it showed that it had 10.0 gallons left in the tank, out of the 16.5 gallons it left Avis with on Sunday.

      That's just shy of 20 MPG. There was some city driving, not a lot of stopped traffic (but this having Start/Stop, shouldn't have contributed to the poor fuel economy), but also a fair amount of highway driving.

      Speaking of the Hybrid, I did try and rent one of those in FL this past winter, but found that it wouldn't fit the stroller in the trunk, nevermind the rest of our luggage. So I went back to the desk and traded it for a Kia Optima, which of course swallowed our bags with ease. FWIW, that returned 33 MPG in mixed usage, pretty respectable for a N/A 4-banger and a 6-speed auto. Similarly, I have a '18 Camry SE that easily does 33-35 MPG in mixed usage.

      Back to the Fusion SEL, I have to say that Ford did make the best of the 181 horsepower and 6-speed auto, and the car was a pleasant place to be in for the few days I had it. The interior is nicely trimmed and laid out, and unsurprisingly it has a lot of European feel to how it drives.

      Maybe that's why Ford pulled the plug on these. Both the simple Kia and my Camry with their N/A engines that make more HP than the Ford, easily outhandle it in the MPG department. This thing is rated 23/32 MPG (still poor compared to the Camry's 29/41 or the Kia's 27/37) so it should have been mid-20's at the very least.

    11. #85
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      Quote Originally Posted by Stevo12 View Post
      Why does Ford Fusion fuel economy suck so much a$$?

      My latest rental was a '20 Fusion SEL, FWD with the 1.5T...like this:



      I've had a few Titanium models with AWD and the 2.0T. They got ~25 MPG on mostly highway trips. That felt low to me but I figured that was the price to pay for 2.0T power and AWD, even if comparable Audi A4's manage to eke out over 30 MPG in similar conditions.

      ple Kia and my Camry with their N/A engines that make more HP than the Ford, easily outhandle it in the MPG department. This thing is rated 23/32 MPG (still poor compared to the Camry's 29/41 or the Kia's 27/37) so it should have been mid-20's at the very least.
      In my personal experience the ecojoke gets dismal MPG for an I-4 , even worse in the Escape. Give me a V6 over these anyday they sound like a tractor

    12. #86
      Member Stevo12's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by ImpeccableNEW View Post
      In my personal experience the ecojoke gets dismal MPG for an I-4 , even worse in the Escape. Give me a V6 over these anyday they sound like a tractor
      I'm right there with you in that the proliferation of turbo 4's in place of a good V6 is a misguided move. I thought this 1.5T ecojoke was pretty smooth, much smoother than the 2.5L in my Camry. I bet even the 3.5L V6 version of the Camry can return better mileage than the 1.5T, with over 1.5x the horsepower.

    13. #87
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      Just had a new Hyundai Santa Fe for the weekend (1300km trip to pick up a dog).

      Was not really a fan of it. Seats were not that comfortable, the transmission was wonky (a couple of times in stop-and-go traffic it just held 2nd or 3rd right up to redline!?!?!), the backup camera wouldn't turn off unless you shifted to park and back to drive... and the active safety stuff was a pain in the ass. Even on the least sensitive mode, the active cruise would start slowing down 4 car lengths behind another car, necessitating annoyingly early moves into the left lane... where it would then accelerate back up so S L OW L Y (we're taking 1kph per second).

      On the plus side it was roomy, and the back seats recline. Lane keep assist worked well. The stereo was alright, minus the buggy bluetooth that would skip like an old CD sometimes...

      TL;DR if they offer you one of these at the counter, see if you can get something else instead.

      Last edited by Chazwozza; 10-02-2020 at 02:10 PM.

    14. #88
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      I got a q50 rwd - first time driving a rwd "sports sedan" - seating position was nice, infotainment sucked (glorified am fm xm radio with a screen) - kinda light steering, but felt precise enough. The v6 made nice nissan vq/be noises, and it was a decent NYC commuter - I kinda see why people drive like twats in these

    15. #89
      I just rented a RAV4 AWD in South Lake Tahoe and drove it one way to San Francisco Airport. I was amazed at the destination fill up it only used 4.7 gallons for that trip. The car was pretty boring and the interior was plastic. Gas mileage was amazing though.

    16. #90
      Member SCHWAB0's Avatar
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      Loaded 2018-? Versa with 30k miles, drive was pretty painful esp. the transmission. did the job tho for 1 way rental.

      pros:
      satellite radio
      big screen
      seats were adequate
      fuel economy

      cons:
      everything else


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      Previous: '95 Talon AWD 2.0T | '98 GTI 2.0 | '00 Jetta 2.0 | '02 GLI 2.8 | '07 GTI 2.0T | '09 GLI 2.0T | '00 A4 2.8 | '04 R32 3.2 | '12 R 2.0T | '01 S4 2.7TT | '14 ST 1.6T | '12 R 2.0T | '16 R 2.0T | '17 R 2.0T | '18 RS3 2.5T | '13 TTRS 2.5T | '04 R32 3.2 |
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    17. #91
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      Quote Originally Posted by Stevo12 View Post
      I'm right there with you in that the proliferation of turbo 4's in place of a good V6 is a misguided move. I thought this 1.5T ecojoke was pretty smooth, much smoother than the 2.5L in my Camry. I bet even the 3.5L V6 version of the Camry can return better mileage than the 1.5T, with over 1.5x the horsepower.
      Camry V6 sounds like a GTR when outfitted with a particular aftermarket exhaustI couldnt believe it

      Id believe toyotas smooth v6 could beat out a 1.5t in fuel economy

      those tiny turbos also annoying run out of juice at higher rpms

    18. #92
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      Quote Originally Posted by Chazwozza View Post

      Was not really a fan of it. Seats were not that comfortable, the transmission was wonky (a couple of times in stop-and-go traffic it just held 2nd or 3rd right up to redline!?!?!), the backup camera wouldn't turn off unless you shifted to park and back to drive... and the active safety stuff was a pain in the ass. Even on the least sensitive mode, the active cruise would start slowing down 4 car lengths behind another car, necessitating annoyingly early moves into the left lane... where it would then accelerate back up so S L OW L Y (we're taking 1kph per second).


      Really , I thought Hyundai had gotten over issues like this

    19. #93
      Senior Member chucchinchilla's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by mitanokaseifu View Post
      I just rented a RAV4 AWD in South Lake Tahoe and drove it one way to San Francisco Airport. I was amazed at the destination fill up it only used 4.7 gallons for that trip. The car was pretty boring and the interior was plastic. Gas mileage was amazing though.
      I'm sure going from 6,000 feet to sea level had nothing to do with it.
      Quote Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
      This forum is more and more of an embarrassment every day...

    20. #94
      Member Stevo12's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by ImpeccableNEW View Post
      Really , I thought Hyundai had gotten over issues like this
      The active cruise on my Camry is similarly conservative. Even on its most aggressive setting, it will clamp down on speed way before it needs to, or when it's prudent to change lanes. It does not have the issue of slow acceleration, though.

      I thought it might have been how active cruise is being design (per some FMVSS standard, or SAE guidance) until I rented a couple Ford Fusions with active cruise, and they allowed NJ-levels of tailgating before they reigned in the car.

      The transmission, I would chalk up to being a rental car. Plenty of cars get confused being put through the wringer of multiple drivers and exuberant lot jockeys. The rearview camera screen = yikes, but even if it's a software glitch, Hyundai's not alone. It seems typical for newer cars to go through lots of infotainment software updates to sort out various bugs, which I agree should get caught in development, but it seems that these get farmed out to 3rd parties. My FIL's Subaru must have gone through several radio updates before it solved several infotainment issues he's had with the car, and it's a 2018 Outback - i.e. high volume, mid-market car from an established automaker. I don't think Hyundai still needs to 'grow out' of its former reputation as they've very well established for years that they are a competent volume producer. I think these kinds of software issues are endemic to the development system that all automakers have adopted at various levels. Hell, even my '18 Camry needed a radio update before I took possession of it.

      [Racism]The seat comfort issue is typical of Asian cars, being short on thigh support.[/racism] [misogyny]Or perhaps Hyundai's acknowledgement of their target demographic, women[/misogyny]

    21. #95
      Quote Originally Posted by chucchinchilla View Post
      Quote Originally Posted by mitanokaseifu View Post
      I just rented a RAV4 AWD in South Lake Tahoe and drove it one way to San Francisco Airport. I was amazed at the destination fill up it only used 4.7 gallons for that trip. The car was pretty boring and the interior was plastic. Gas mileage was amazing though.
      I'm sure going from 6,000 feet to sea level had nothing to do with it. <img src="https://www.vwvortex.com/Anthony/Smilies/wink.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Wink" class="inlineimg" />
      True, but there is a 1,000 foot climb to Echo Summit. At 4.7 gallons in 200 miles it is about 42mpg. This is not the hybrid either. Maybe I am amazed because I drove my Jeep ZJ one way up there and got about 14mpg.

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