2021 BMW M3/M4 to be Unveiled Sept23 - Page 25
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    1. #601
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      Quote Originally Posted by KrisA View Post
      About a stupid idea.

      I'll never understand the idea of instantly voiding your powertrain warrantee on a new car. The main reason of buying new is warrantee IMO.
      Well, you did say 'IMO'. There's lots of reasons people buy new cars--to have the latest tech, to spec it themselves, to start with a clean vehicle, etc. Personally I care about all of those to some degree but couldn't care less about warranty.

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    3. #602
      Member SCHWAB0's Avatar
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      2021 BMW M3/M4 to be Unveiled Sept23

      Wouldn't the RS3 sans headroom satisfy evry single one of your wants?

      I test drove an RS5 and walked away unimpressed, it's really good at what it does, maybe too good and subtle and it doesn't help that it depreciates much quicker than most RS cars. interior wise is almost as small as the A3 Platform.

      Value wise a Golf R is hard to beat especially tuned and what it offers. Plop an RS3 and a few used CPO AMG cars in your valie chart...lord knows you don't want to own a German car out of warranty


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      Previous: '95 Talon AWD 2.0T | '98 GTI 2.0 | '00 Jetta 2.0 | '02 GLI 2.8 | '07 GTI 2.0T | '09 GLI 2.0T | '00 A4 2.8 | '04 R32 3.2 | '12 R 2.0T | '01 S4 2.7TT | '14 ST 1.6T | '12 R 2.0T | '16 R 2.0T | '17 R 2.0T | '18 RS3 2.5T | '13 TTRS 2.5T | '04 R32 3.2 |
      VW/Audi Installation YT Vids: Schwabo

    4. #603
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      Quote Originally Posted by SCHWAB0 View Post
      Wouldn't the RS3 sans headroom satisfy evry single one of your wants?

      I test drove an RS5 and walked away unimpressed, it's really good at what it does, maybe too good and subtle and it doesn't help that it depreciates much quicker than most RS cars. interior wise is almost as small as the A3 Platform.

      Value wise a Golf R is hard to beat especially tuned and what it offers. Plop an RS3 and a few used CPO AMG cars in your valie chart...lord knows you don't want to own a German car out of warranty


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      He said it was unrefined and given that the stock brake pads on his Golf lasted 80k KM, spirited driving isn't his thing, so it must be an image perception thing.

    5. #604
      Member GLI Dan's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Cabin Pics View Post
      I test drove an M2 Comp earlier this year.

      As soon as I got in the car the "product specialist" that was riding with me told me I should turn all the nannies off "to get a feel for the car".

      Okay dude. If you say so.

      It was a little damp and we came to a traffic circle almost immediately. I'll never forget him yelling at me to turn them back on as I held the ass out half way around the circle. Oh that was hilarious.

      So the new ones will spin, but everything has to be off. As you said, with it on, it's pretty much impossible. You can kick the tail out a bit, and keep it there, but it will pull you right back in and stop the fun if you try to really go slideways.
      Can attest to the current "traction" control systems ability to make anyone almost idiot proof. I haven't dared do that with the M4 out and about, I know I'll spin it because I have not really got a grasp on where the limit is, there just simply aren't opportunities to do so. I need to read the fine print on how the half-way of setting works, MDC I think? Supposed to allow rotation, but still have some nannies. The fact that the system literally asks you to confirm with a yes or no before allowing you to hit that switch has prevented me from testing it out. Even with everything on it'll allow a small bit of slip so long as it sees your steering input is going to keep the car on the right trajectory.

      Quote Originally Posted by sandwich-chris View Post
      He said it was unrefined and given that the stock brake pads on his Golf lasted 80k KM, spirited driving isn't his thing, so it must be an image perception thing.
      VW jetta/golf rear pads lasting 50K+ miles has been pretty normal for at least the MK4 forward.
      Quote Originally Posted by DzlDub View Post
      Cars are ****ing awesome, anyone who doesn't want a car is a communist.
      Disclaimer: Generally, I strongly dislike people.
      Current: 2016 BMW M4
      Prior Vehicles: '18 Infiniti Q50RS l '13 E92 335i M-Sport l '04 E46 330ci SMG l '04 MKIV GLI 1.8t 6spd

    6. #605
      Member Hawk's Avatar
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      Just got back from a 1-hour test drive in a 2020 S5 Sportback so let me give my impressions while they're still fresh in my mind.

      1) It's a really, really solid/nice car.

      2) Between the C43 and M340i I definitely liked it the most. Maybe I'm just a VW Group guy, but it felt really comfortable to me.

      3) Thing I was most impressed by was the suspension that was firm, but not too firm and just soaked up everything on the downtown streets where I drive most.

      4) Also loved the interior. Really nicely laid out, really high quality, didn't feel like it had any gimmicks like the BMW and Mercedes. Felt more mature.







      But goddamn, the Golf R is just so good at what it does, I still definitely preferred things on my 4-year old VW to this new Audi.

      1) R has nicer seats that just hug you more and don't feel too flat or narrow.

      2) R's DSG transmission shifts faster and feels more fun than S5 regular automatic. This was a big one for me. I'll be sad if DSG's will be going the way of manuals.

      3) R's Fender system sounded better than the B&O upgrade in the S5. Although in this department maybe my ears just aren't refined enough and I like Big Mac over steak.

      4) R felt faster than this car. Off the line and mid gear acceleration.

      5) R has ample headroom. I don't know what it is with Audis, I'm only 5'10'' but on this car too, with the seat all the way on the floor, if I put the seat-back in the proper upright position and didn't slouch I would hit my head on the headliner on rough roads. Are you kidding me???? Same issue on the RS3. It's nuts.

      So.... all that said, do I want to keep my fully paid off R or go and drop $78,000CDN on a new car (they'd probably give me $25K for my R) so total upgrade cost would be around $53K CDN.

      I think I'm keeping the R a little bit longer. Maybe we'll see what the e-Tron GT is like next.

      Last edited by Hawk; 10-08-2020 at 08:57 PM.
      1989 Jetta GLX 16V | 2001 VW GTI 1.8T | 2005 Porsche Boxster 2.7 | 2006 VW GTI 1.8T | 2007 Porsche Cayman 2.7 | 2014 Porsche 911 3.6 | 2017 VW Golf R 2.0T

    7. #606
      Member SchnellFowVay's Avatar
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      womp womp

      EDIT: In all seriousness, just upgrade your Golf R to stage 2 engine and stage 2 DSG.

      It will feel like a new car, and it will only cost you ~$2,500. My stage 2 S3 is a blast. I occasionally think I might want something new, but the cost to get something appreciably better for everyday driving is very, very high.
      Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Russells View Post
      I used to pack his chute all the time

    8. #607
      Member SchnellFowVay's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post




      Does this have white exhaust tips? What am I looking at here?
      Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Russells View Post
      I used to pack his chute all the time

    9. #608
      Senior Member danny_16v's Avatar
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      Surprised the GolfR compares so well, but honestly the S5 is probably alot heavier and maybe just doesn't feel that much greater. I'd love to try a GolfR at some point... they seem really nice. I've heard with a couple bolt ons they're very fun.
      GLi : M3 : CX5
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    10. #609
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      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      Does this have white exhaust tips? What am I looking at here?
      I think you might have quoted the wrong pic--


      but frosted tips are making a comeback!

      I think it's chrome, just covered in condensation or dust.

    11. #610
      Member Hawk's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      Just upgrade your Golf R to stage 2 engine and stage 2 DSG.
      It's so wild we can do transmission upgrades too these days. I might do both.


      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      Does this have white exhaust tips? What am I looking at here?
      Chrome covered in mud from dirty road spray.
      1989 Jetta GLX 16V | 2001 VW GTI 1.8T | 2005 Porsche Boxster 2.7 | 2006 VW GTI 1.8T | 2007 Porsche Cayman 2.7 | 2014 Porsche 911 3.6 | 2017 VW Golf R 2.0T

    12. #611
      Member Jimmy Russells's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      Does this have white exhaust tips? What am I looking at here?
      Dried dirt/mud

      Downtown Toronto life

    13. #612
      Member Hawk's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by danny_16v View Post
      The S5 is probably a lot heavier
      Yeah S5 is 1,700 pounds more than Golf R. That's a lot.

      *** CORRECTION 700 lbs ***
      Last edited by Hawk; 10-08-2020 at 08:59 PM.
      1989 Jetta GLX 16V | 2001 VW GTI 1.8T | 2005 Porsche Boxster 2.7 | 2006 VW GTI 1.8T | 2007 Porsche Cayman 2.7 | 2014 Porsche 911 3.6 | 2017 VW Golf R 2.0T

    14. #613
      Member Jimmy Russells's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
      Yeah S5 is 1,700 pounds more than Golf R. That's a lot.
      What? No way

      Golf R is what 3600? No way an S5 is over 5000 lbs

    15. #614
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      Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Russells View Post
      What? No way

      Golf R is what 3600? No way an S5 is over 5000 lbs
      3305 for the Golf R and 4010 for the Sportback, so 705 lbs difference.
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    16. #615
      Member gti5dr06's Avatar
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      man everytime i see a white metallic over red leather drool. I think if the RS3 allowed those sweet seats the decision would be easy for me.
      Quote Originally Posted by konigwheels View Post
      Wow, it amazes me that we have children in here that can't read a couple paragraphs. No wonder America's doing so well in education! Can't take the time to read, but sure can find the time to post. Self indulgence at it's finest.

      TL;DR should be banned and changed to ID;CR or I'm dumb, can't read.

    17. #616
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      Why has the G80 unveiling thread devolved into another thread the attention whore takes off topic?

      Any mods here?

    18. #617
      Member Jimmy Russells's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by MaX PL View Post
      Why has the G80 unveiling thread devolved into another thread the attention whore takes off topic?

      Any mods here?

      He did create it, so maybe that gets a pass

    19. #618
      Member Hawk's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by MaX PL View Post
      Why has the G80 unveiling thread devolved into another thread the attention whore takes off topic?
      Hey, if the M3/M4 weren't so ugly, this thread never would have gone off topic.

      Good new is we can get back on topic now cause I ain't buying the S5 no more.

      Maybe you can post something interesting about the M3/M4 to get it back on track.

      1989 Jetta GLX 16V | 2001 VW GTI 1.8T | 2005 Porsche Boxster 2.7 | 2006 VW GTI 1.8T | 2007 Porsche Cayman 2.7 | 2014 Porsche 911 3.6 | 2017 VW Golf R 2.0T

    20. #619
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      Quote Originally Posted by GLI Dan View Post
      Can attest to the current "traction" control systems ability to make anyone almost idiot proof. I haven't dared do that with the M4 out and about, I know I'll spin it because I have not really got a grasp on where the limit is, there just simply aren't opportunities to do so. I need to read the fine print on how the half-way of setting works, MDC I think? Supposed to allow rotation, but still have some nannies. The fact that the system literally asks you to confirm with a yes or no before allowing you to hit that switch has prevented me from testing it out. Even with everything on it'll allow a small bit of slip so long as it sees your steering input is going to keep the car on the right trajectory.
      The traction control on the F8x cars is insanely intrusive, including MDM. This is realistically good, but it's annoying. I wouldn't go full off for the first few months I had the car but once I noticed the traction light flashing under acceleration levels that I knew weren't enough to be getting actual wheelspin I got dumb and now I run with it off most of the time if I'm not on the highway or something. In snow you can get some actual rotation with MDM but I've found that it kills any fun almost immediately everywhere else. I think the car is pretty docile if you aren't doing really dumb **** and that's even with a stage 1 tune.

    21. #620
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      $400 off for a $78000 car is kind of an insult.
      “I am not a Mac user unless under duress.” - John Carmack

    22. #621
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      Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post

      2007 Cayman $95,000

      How tho?
      Current | Mk7 GTI
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    23. #622
      Member GLI Dan's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by fknlo View Post
      The traction control on the F8x cars is insanely intrusive, including MDM. This is realistically good, but it's annoying. I wouldn't go full off for the first few months I had the car but once I noticed the traction light flashing under acceleration levels that I knew weren't enough to be getting actual wheelspin I got dumb and now I run with it off most of the time if I'm not on the highway or something. In snow you can get some actual rotation with MDM but I've found that it kills any fun almost immediately everywhere else. I think the car is pretty docile if you aren't doing really dumb **** and that's even with a stage 1 tune.
      MMM, I think we have slightly different interpretations of intrusive. Yes, the T/C will flicker under full acceleration, in particular at around 5500 RPM and when shifting 1-2, 2-3 and even 3-4, but it doesn't bog the car down which is why I deem it to not be overly intrusive. But you are correct that it is a helicopter parent in its attentiveness.

      I wish there were some place i could fool around with MDM a bit, I'm finding it incredibly difficult to find the break away point for traction on the car because I simply have to be going far too fast for public roadways. Sure I can force a rotation, but if I'm hustling I'd like to know when to expect a loss of traction rather than have to react to it.
      Quote Originally Posted by DzlDub View Post
      Cars are ****ing awesome, anyone who doesn't want a car is a communist.
      Disclaimer: Generally, I strongly dislike people.
      Current: 2016 BMW M4
      Prior Vehicles: '18 Infiniti Q50RS l '13 E92 335i M-Sport l '04 E46 330ci SMG l '04 MKIV GLI 1.8t 6spd

    24. #623
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      @Hawk I knew you wouldn't like the S5, it's a good car on paper and even better as an RS trim but still lacking. The DSG > ZF 10x over ... the engagement and smoothness of the ZF is definitely aimed at the execs and people who are in their 60s . You'll find yourself lost in a sea of amazing cars that look good on paper until you test drive them. You will compare every car to the R and the value/$ is hard to beat. I would actually wait until the new R/S3 comes out and revisit .. you might like that better.
      Previous: '95 Talon AWD 2.0T | '98 GTI 2.0 | '00 Jetta 2.0 | '02 GLI 2.8 | '07 GTI 2.0T | '09 GLI 2.0T | '00 A4 2.8 | '04 R32 3.2 | '12 R 2.0T | '01 S4 2.7TT | '14 ST 1.6T | '12 R 2.0T | '16 R 2.0T | '17 R 2.0T | '18 RS3 2.5T | '13 TTRS 2.5T | '04 R32 3.2 |
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    25. #624
      Geriatric Member absoluteczech's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post

      5) R has ample headroom. I don't know what it is with Audis, I'm only 5'10'' but on this car too, with the seat all the way on the floor, if I put the seat-back in the proper upright position and didn't slouch I would hit my head on the headliner on rough roads. Are you kidding me???? Same issue on the RS3. It's nuts.
      we've been saying this for nearly 1 year already when you were considering an S5 back in Dec/Jan

      Glad you came to your senses

    26. #625
      Member fknlo's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by GLI Dan View Post
      MMM, I think we have slightly different interpretations of intrusive. Yes, the T/C will flicker under full acceleration, in particular at around 5500 RPM and when shifting 1-2, 2-3 and even 3-4, but it doesn't bog the car down which is why I deem it to not be overly intrusive. But you are correct that it is a helicopter parent in its attentiveness.

      I wish there were some place i could fool around with MDM a bit, I'm finding it incredibly difficult to find the break away point for traction on the car because I simply have to be going far too fast for public roadways. Sure I can force a rotation, but if I'm hustling I'd like to know when to expect a loss of traction rather than have to react to it.
      The first time I did a pull up to highway speeds with traction control off I realized how much it was actually pulling power. Power that the car actually handles pretty well. My biggest issue with it was it pulling power leaving stop lights and **** when I was absolutely not doing anything that would have led to wheelspin. Being a 2015 with the software the car shipped with probably doesn't help with that. They've made a lot of incremental upgrades to everything over the years. I've thought about having the car updated to the latest software it can handle but I think it's more of a hassle than it's worth since I'm tuned.

      I also don't really know what the break away point is for the same reasons which is why I'll run with MDM if I'm hitting some canyons. In my experience it doesn't really allow for much if any extra fun.

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